OK, I finished The Big Sort, and I have to say that while I agree with the observations of the author and his collegues, and I understand their point, I think that in the scope of their exploration they have missed an important factor.

Far be it from me to nit-pick people much smarter than myself, but they have thoroughly explored the results of insulating yourself from the "sanity check"...you and your little group become progressivly more extreme.  (Sanity check: compareing your perceptions of the world to those of others as a way to moderate your opinions).

But they don't seem to address at all the power of the reality check.

Granted, the reality check takes longer, because the conflict of an erroneous position with reality generally has to build up consequences to the point where you can no longer ignore them.

However, we have been here before.  There was a time when the world-view of most people was one completely inconsistant with reality...and eventually people began to depart from the demon-haunted view of the world, and turn toward a more reasoned approach.  Some people require a much more strenuous thump-on-the-head than others...but eventually, most people come around.

I'm not sure how much off the track our society has to become before we reach that tipping-point when we return to sense...but I'd like to think we are approaching it right now.

I guess we'll find out soon.

I'd like to call your attention to a few new blogs in the blogroll.

I've added some religious blogs, as examples of who I am NOT talking about in my "wacky fundies" posts.

Erudite Redneck    - wacky (in a good way) not fundie.

God & Life            - Fundie - not wacky

Monastic Mumbligs - Not fundie, not wacky (yet strangely, still interesting)

The Watering Hole  -also not fundie, and not wacky

Or not a Real Christian (TM) with a brain all abuzz with "Sound Doctrine" (TM)...

...but you've always thought that Jesus fellow would be someone you could get behind and root for...

You'll probably like this.

(Hat Tip: The Yurica Report)

There's going to be a hue and cry about this, and you're probably all going to see it, so you might as well see it here:

It's not going to quite make the "nameing a Teddy-Bear Mohammad" level of outcry...mobs will not be calling for blood because of it, at least not on anything more than a metaphorical level.

On the other hand, you can bet that it WILL create outcry.

I've heard Conservative Christians proudly proclaim that the Gospel is offensive.  They declare it to be "not politically correct".  They use this to justify their condemnation of others.

But even more offensive is the idea that we are called by their gospel to be servants to one another,  to minister to one another, and to forgive one another, and yes, to turn the other cheek. 

This picture of the concept of Christ as an emblem of humilty and healing in the face of great wrong will, of course, be deeply offensive...probably even mocked as the perversion "Gandhi Christ", and appelation I have heard on more than one occasion.

And that offense will serve the very ordinary purpose of covering a very ordinary condition of being unable to transcend our humaness.

No matter how many platitudes and pontifications are made about "foundations of morality" or having been "made a new creature"...

You're still just a human being.  But.  You are a human being who can IMAGINE a condition where a man could bend down and act as a servant to his enemies, giving them comfort, healing their wounds, and dissapating their wrath.

This picture is a challenge, and an offensive, uncomfortable one at that.  By that measure, which of us can succeed?  Fortunately, for the more non-dogmatic among us, falling short is not a death sentance.  It is merely a continuation of the challenge, to cultivate a person who can approach this ideal.

For those of us who HAVE no religion, it is not necessary to believe that Jesus was God, or even if he was a flesh-and-blood man.  The mere fact that we can conceive of a person so humble, so inoffensive, and yet so noble that he can dispell the aggression and hate of his enemies is a challenge, for us to take up or ignore as we are so inspired.  Must the same as our friends and neighbors who DO have religion.

The good news is, that's you are SUPPOSED to be human.  So get to work being the best one you can make of your self in the time you have.

And stop counting on someone else to do it for you.

(Double hat tip to: Monk-in-Training and Random Reflections)

Monk-in-Training has a take on the "Doubting Thomas" story that I have never heard before.

I like it.

It makes a lot more sense than anything I've ever heard on the subject before.

That probably means it's horribly, horribly, wrong and will lead us all down the feel-good primrose path to hell.  :-)

I'd be really worried if I believed in hell.

I'm involved in a discussion group about a book called "Jim and Casper Go to Church" - written by Jim Henderson, a pastor/housepainter and Matt Casper, an atheist hired by Jim to accompany him to various Christian churches.

Disclaimer: Our discussion group is not unbiased- it is held in a United Methodist church, and most attendees are members. However- it has proven so far (on week 4) to at least be a healthy discussion, and not a debate. I'm honestly not a real fan of debate- or the whole "I'm right, you're wrong, and I could prove it if only you weren't so narrow-minded."

The opinions expressed in our class range from socially moderate to socially liberal, but don't cover extremes. As a rule, legalistic Christians view our church as anything from slightly misguided (not enough focus on sin) to blasphemous (preaching the untruth) and therefore steer clear. OTOH- I would say our church doesn't really appeal to the unchurched, atheists, or extremist liberals because it is difficult for some to believe the motto posted on our door "Open Hearts, Open Doors, and Open Minds", could apply to any Christian, no matter how well-meaning they may be.

Jim the Christian, recruited Casper the Atheist from an Off the Map blog contest to find an atheist willing to attend churches and speak openly about his experiences (The site is: http://www.off-the-map.org/atheist/ . Don't look for the same commitment to open-mindedness here-the threads too often are  dominated by people with an agenda-though they are generally polite about it.)

ANYHOO- these two guys, who become good friends, travel all over the country to visit many different types and sizes of churches, and this book documents the experience. In our group of about 20, questions based on the book are posed to us and we are invited to share our perspectives.

Some of Casper's observations demand a response. In one example, at Willow Creek- a mega-church outside Chicago, Casper is astounded to hear the preacher thank people for their prayers to help him land an interview with Bono. Casper says, "People are being killed needlessly in every corner of the world, kids are starving, and people are praying for their pastor to meet a rock star? That's ludicrous."

This does not resemble our church prayer experience- in fact Pastor Bill once got a complaint that his prayers for peace, and to help us to do as Jesus taught- to feed the poor, visit the sick and imprisoned, have compassion for the mentally ill, and to love our neighbors, etc. were too depressing. Yet I think it helps us to understand the perspective of non-Christians who think that at best we are largely failing in our call to help those in need, and at worst, whipping up a frenzy against "sinners" (which means everyone NOT like them), praying for personal wealth while we ignore the cries of the poor (clearly they are poor because they are "sinners") and praying for our pastors to win famous friends and influence people.  When you look at sheer numbers, Willow Creek has 20,0000 attendees each week, so its influence can't be ignored. It is obvious that these megachurches are as good at marketing as the more legalistic churches are at lobbying for political influence (If that point isn't obvious, just search "those wacky fundies" on Teresa's blog, and grab a coffee- cuz' you'll be reading a while.)

A large chunk of the questions from Casper in this book ask "If Jesus did X, why aren't you focused on X?", based on his experience visiting these churches. It is fair to say that this was his take-away more often than not.

There were also a couple of times Casper felt genuinely moved (not moved in the God-sense, but in a way he describes as "the humans' need for expression taking over"), and a couple instances where he was blown away by the positive impact a church had individuals or their community- hard-core criminals who authentically turned their lives around, and one church in an impoverished area that began their mission by providing a washer and dryer for the homeless to use so they could wash their clothes before appearing for a job interview, and now provides a free health clinic, free daycare, and builds no-profit homes for low-income people in abandoned neighborhoods.

Out of curiosity, I looked up some numbers. According to the Association of Religous Data Archives: http://www.thearda.com/mapsReports/reports/US_2000.asp   US mainline protestants +26,150,866, Catholics 62,035,042, Orthodox 989,106, Evangelical Protestant 39,935,307, Other religions 12,254,099 and Unclaimed 140,057,419 (which includes atheists as well as all others who were not adherents of any of the 188 groups included). Interesting. There are 3x as many Unclaimed as there are Evangelicals.

Our church is lumped in with the Mainline Protestants. Seeing the number 26,150,866 leads me to believe that if we strived to improve on practicing what we preach- that is a LOT of potential to help the poor, sick, and oppressed. Considering many of my friends fall in the Unclaimed group, and I know they too desire to help the poor, sick, and the oppressed- it helps me see how important it is to find common ground and pool our resources, and for Christians to, as Jim puts it "NOT be jerks to non-Christians."  In order to do this, we have to be willing to really get to know people beyond their soundbite "I'm an atheist" or "I'm a Christian" or "I'm a Wiccan", or whatever.

I guess that's the point of attempting to have an open dialogue versus a Convince-Fest.

Pastor Bill is gone this week, and I volunteered to lead the discussion on Wednesday night- and no one objected loudly enough to stop me, so if any of you have your own thoughts or perceptions you'd like to share, I'm interested to read them, and to share them with our group. Thank you to all who are willing to share, let others be heard, and not attempt to dominate the discussion or convince anyone of your stance.

Trees' friend Sue.

Ben at Eclecticsanonymous has an entry up about Prussian Blue again.

For me, the relevant quote in the video he referanced is:  "People change".

To me that is the most important thing in the whole clip.  I have watched the twins casually since they first came to my attention on Jason Bock's blog a while ago.

All along, I have told myself that kids grow up and that people change.

Maybe these unfortunate girls will triumph over their upbringing and learn that you can love who you are. and that it isn't a choice between being proud to be white, or ashamed to be white..."white" is a description, and idea, a shorthand.  It carries fragments of an identity, but only fragments.

Just look at the white supremicists sometimes.  Watch them talk to each other.  They can't even decide definativly what "white" is.

"Race" is a powerful part of a peson's identity...but try to define what it means...it's part of you, but what part?  To what extent?  What is there about your race that you can plant a flag in and say "This is what my race makes of me?"

When you try to do that, you realize how slippery the idea really is, and how futile and unnatural it is to try to define everything you are and everything you think and feel and do by your race.  Just as it is futile and unnatural to do so with anyone else.

An upsetting article about a woman who died in police custody.

I don't recall the exact quote, but I recall Paine writing about how brutality in punishment and treatment of prisoners leads to a general harness of heart and general brutality of spirit in a society, such that it cheapens life, humanity, and human dignity generally in society and lessens the ability of the people to excersise compassion.

How do we think it will effect the other people held in that jail, that they watched one of their fellow prisoners die without care, comfort, or help?  Will we be able to expect compassion and decency from them?  Only if they themselves triumph over the experience.  They certainly have nothing useful along that lines from this experience.

When someone says something about Iraqi civillians unable to count on medical care, or hurt as "collateral damage" in the war, people shrug and say 3000 of our own people died on 9/11.  We watched people who became representatives of a whole society murder our countrymen right before our eyes, and many of us reacted by having a brutal and callous attitude to an entire culture.  Brutality and callousness beget brutality and callousness.

If you watched someone die right before your eyes while representatives empowered by your society simply watched and did nothing, would you feel obligated to care about that society or any of its members?  Would you feel motivated to re-join that society as a useful and productive member?  Would you trust any social compact offered by that society?

Much is being made of this video.  Some people think that it is a bunch of rude, obnoxious, theocratic extremeists trying to silence a religious blessing upon our government from a holy man from a significant minority group who contributes greatly to the richness of our society.

Nothing could be further from the truth.  The truth is that our Deist founders who didn't believe in organized religion, nevertheless decreed that the United States was a Christian nation.  Sure, natural law was a good enough way for them to live THIER lives, but for the country, they thought that bronze age morality was the cure and they said no other religion could be practiced publicly.

And don't quote me Jefferson's letter to the Baptist convention about the "Wall of Seperation" malarky.  That was just a ruse to lull the non-Christians into a false sense of security.

Anyway.  What's going on here is that the Christians are exersising both their RIGHT to use their free speech to silence other religions, and their SACRED OBLIGATION to harass non-Christian in the country.  And by non Christians, I mean non- Protestants.

Protestants are the REAL church...no matter what the Pope says.

I mean, who does this Hindu holy man think he is anyway?  What makes him think that we WANT to ask to be guided by the supreme deity who created and runs the universe, and have our deliberations and decisions and actions subject to his laws?  What makes him think that we have any obligation to remember that we are part of a country that is part of a planet, that is part of a universal system whose reality we are subject to, and whithin which we are called to function with the best possible expression of our nature?

Oh. Wait.  I guess this must explain something that someone has called to my attention:  Some Christians think that liberal Christians are actually Hindus.  LOL.  Maybe we should re-think the percentage of Hindues that make up the population.  Maybe we need to add more Hindu chaplains.

It seems almost futile for religion to call people to humility anymore.

(double Hat Tip:  Eclecticsanonymous)

Also, Jason Bock has commentary on this.

Discuss

While you are at it, you can also discuss Neil's implication that a cluster of cells should have more rights than the woman it is living inside of because you can't prove that it is less of a person than she is.

"How barbarous, to deny men the privilage of pursuing what they imagine to be their proper concerns and interests!  Yet, in a sense, this is what you are doing when you allow your indignation to rise at their wrongdoing; for after all, they are only following their own apparent concerns and interests.  You say they are mistaken?  Why then, tell them so, and explain it to them, instead of being indignant."

                                                                           --Marcus Aurelius Book VI note 27

I realized that I had been neglecting Marcus Aurelius, and it does show in my approach to life recently.  Since I found this one instructive, I thought I'd share it.

"When, in countries that are called civilized, we see age going to the workhouse and youth to the gallows, something must be wrong with the system of government.  It would seem, by the exterior appearance of such countries, that all was happiness; but there lies hidden from the eye of common observance, a mass of wretchedness that has scarcely any other chance, than to expire in poverty or infamy.  Its entrance into life is marked with the presage of its fate; and until this is remedied, it is vain to punish.

Civil government does not consist in executions; but in making that provision for the instruction of youth, and the support of age, as to exclude, as much as possible, the profligacy from the one, and despair from the other.  Instead of this, the resources of the country are lavished upon kings, upon courts, upon hirelings, imposters and prostitutes; and even the poor themselves, with all their wants upon them, are compelled to support the fraud that opresses them."

                                           -- Thomas Paine, "The Rights of Man, part two" 

Remember the American Revolution?  Remember what we were revolting against?  Allow Thomas Paine to remind you, and realize that the American Revolution needs to be refreshed.  If we do it now, we can do it with our hearts and minds and votes:

"A childish set of thinkers and half-way politicians born in the last century; men who went no farther with any priciple than as it suited their purpose as a party; the nation was always left out of the question; and this has been the character of every party from that day to this.  The nation sees nothing in such works, or such politics worthy its attention.  A little matter will move a party, but it must be something great which moves a nation."

                                                      -- Thomas Paine

                                                           The Rights of Man, part II

"Conduct your victory as if it were a funeral."

                             -- Lao Tzu

Later today, or possibly on Tuesday, I'm going to watch the movie "The Smartest Men in the Room".

I can't help but wonder...what is the appropriate punishment for being instrumental in severly damaging the economy of your country?  I know, they'll probably get 12 or so years of prison...but what does that do?  What will it teach them?  Nothing, most likely.

My friend Karen thinks they should have to do menial labor for minimum wage.

That's an idea.  Make them work at McDonalds and pay rent and buy food and send their children to school in the clothes you can buy on minimum wage.  Make them stand in line at public offices looking for assistance.  Have them sit with their child in the emergency room for hours and hours and hours because the child has an ear infection and the emergency room is the only place you can go that has to treat you with or without insurance.

Let them get to know bright young kids with big dreams working two 15-hour a week jobs so they can go to a public college and maybe someday make 30-50 thousand dollars a year.  Let them work with the fry-cook who builds computers in his garage and sells them on the side...or the retiree who mans the cash register because some corporate brass-hole stole his pension.

Nah...it'll never work.  They can't learn compassion.  Just clap 'em in irons and put them in a real prison.  Something drab, and dull and common.  Make them eat in a mess hall with hundreds of other men that they would normally not even bother to look at.

I don't know what you could possibly do to wring some remorse and contrition out of their hearts.  I can't think of a thing that would help all those people who lost their pensions and their livelihoods in the scandal.

There's not really anything that can "make it right".  I guess that's life...

But at the very least, we get to say "They're guilty".  And that's a start. 

Many thanks to Ben,

who e-mailed me the link to this wonderful entertaining video.

It's a little funny, a little horrifying, and a little heartbreaking...but mostly it's just true.