"Real meaning of life...stuff" - Daniel Jackson
Wednesday, May 23, 2007
Wednesday, May 23, 2007 3:31:47 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Teresa,
I suspect this problem is bigger than the war on drugs, though related. California is experiencing a huge gang problem due to drugs and illegal immigration from Central America. This is partly a problem of drugs (Americans want them so demand creates a good paying industry), partly a problem of the global economy (many in central America cannot make a living making cheap goods to sell here and economies are faltering due to subsidies) and there is an immigration problem (young adults smuggled here as children are sent back to countries they know nothing about and without any support system are falling prey to gangs to survive). Maybe I misread, but I thought the article mentioned increased spending on rehabilitation. The question was whether rehabilitation was working in reasonable relation to what it was costing. I am thinking of the problem as possibly being like that of healthcare; we spend lots on it but don't get the best care. We shouldn't look at the problem soley in terms of cost but in terms of cost-benefit.
Having said that. I am aware of the fact that we as a nation have been steadily defunding higher education while simultaeously demanding that citizens get higher ed to be elligible for work in practice (I confess I always think the "right to work" argument against unionism is silly on some levels. People should not be clamoring against unions as much as they should be clamoring against a system that demands one pay about 10,000.00 for a degree to get a job one's parents did with a highschool education. THAT's pay to work if ever I saw it!). So, like you, I am appalled that we have money for prisons and not for schools but I am not surprised. Problem people create service industries. Well adjusted people who can think and solve problems on their own don't.
a small penguin
Wednesday, May 23, 2007 5:37:19 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Where do funds for libraries and university classes for inmates fall into the equation?
Wednesday, May 23, 2007 11:37:04 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Karen,
According to sources I have read (like http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2007/01/letter-from-soledad-prison_28.html) the libraries in prisons are largely self funded. In additon there are little tricks like having the book due after one week but only letting the inmate go to the library every two weeks and fining the prisoner the price of the book. Read the above link, it's an eye opener on the California prison system.

a small penguin, (can I call you asp? ;-)
There are a few things driving the rising prison populations in America. The first is the high murder rate in America; you can pick your reason for it - gun ownership, drug use, gangs, hordes of mutants prowling the streets at night. The second reason has to do with the attempted 'crackdown' on crack dealing with draconian sentences for minimal ammounts. (Interestingly, economist Steven Levitt showed that crack dealers were more likely to be killed in the 1990s while dealing than people on death row. Perhaps it would have been better to leave them on the streets.) Finally, 'three strikes' laws get all the 'worst of the worst' off the streets and where the taxpayer (or at least the correction officer unions) can keep an eye on them.

All these things lead to the sad fact that while California might lead America in costs, America is head and shoulders above the world in prison populations; Not just per capita, total prisoners.: USA=2,193,798; China= 1,548,498, the rest of the world combined=5,567,751. Ouch.(http://www.kcl.ac.uk/depsta/rel/icps/worldbrief/highest_to_lowest_rates.php).

So ask yourself. Is the rest of the world (like Europe) collapsing in chaos with evil do-ers roaming the streets? Perhaps the American justice system is screwed up? Or are Americans just genetically really, really, really bad?
Friday, May 25, 2007 7:22:31 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Ben,
An asp is a venomous snake...... : )
I have to say I adore you for using the word kerfuffle TWICE in one blog. Fantastic!
I agree that the war on drugs is totally wacked (to use my best speech). There are too many documented accounts of police using it to sieze the liberty and property of completely innocent citizens and represents a tremendous waste of human potential in the way the laws treat offenders. It's also just plain unamerican. Prison reform and the idea of rehabilitation was a strong movement in America because we belived in the power of humanity to change and become better people ( I know the conservative view has also always been in force but I like to claim America as mine too, on occassion, especially since I can't go to CA quite yet). I don't have a problem with the govt trying to get citizens to use fewer or no drugs. The two drug houses on my street are gone now and so are the gun fights, grafitti and all that. I used to drive home from work and see the crack whores and it really broke my heart to these 20 year old women who looked 50 selling 10.00 blow jobs for crack, but it annoyed me to be propositioned every Sunday morning (only woman walking on the street so they thought they would give it a shot?). I am equally unnerved by all the children on ritalin. But I don't know that simply decriminalizing drugs or stopping teh drug war would be a good thing without understanding why we have such a problem or what it would mean to "stop the war on drugs". So, I think you ask the right question: what is wrong with Americans? I think there are many issues but one is our rugged individualism has been morphing into a rabid individualism. The original idea was "with a little help from my friends, I can take care of myself, thank you". Now, people seem to think it means "I can do whatever the F I want and it's none of your business". When this includes taking mind and brain altering substances we have a problem. Our freedoms are predicated on the concept that we can rationally control our own behaviour and don't need a governemental agency to do it for us. Some drugs make us incapable of making rational choices and as such are a threat to a free people. Throw in guns, ignorance, fast cars and a bad understanding of traffic laws, which I believe Teresa covered in another post, and we have a problem.

Be afraid, be very afraid... : }
a small penguin
Friday, May 25, 2007 7:24:37 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
"because we belived in the power of humanity to change and become better people"

My apologies! If there were a God, that sentence would not have been allowed to be created. Hopefully, you know what I meant.
a small penguin
Friday, May 25, 2007 9:39:10 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
pengiun,

Thanks. Kerfuffel is one of *my* favorite words. (It just has such a nice - um – taste.)

I always wonder if American extremism, in all directions, isn't driven by nudges in one direction or the other and a balancing nudge from the other side. The right moves out and the left responds. Depending on who is in power the balance is slightly shifted but the areas though of as acceptable have moved.

Look at prohibition. One of the things that lead to the rise of organized crime was to make alcohol illegal. That drove the prices up and made it good to be bad. A few years of illegal alcohol funded organized crime up through the 1960s. Then the older networks got replaced by the drug lords who were more violent and had far more capital to invest.

The problem with the drug culture is that there are relatively few pushing drugs but a lot of people willing to sell them. Add to that social environments where escapism is almost necessary, you start having a problem. I too have lived in less than wonderful parts of cities. It isn’t fun. Usually you’re under less of a threat from the people who recognize you than from the strangers walking on the wild side.

But are Americans bad. No. But extremism breeds extremism and Americans want to be the best at everything, even being extremist. My problem is trying to solve the problem and I don’t see any good ways out. There is a tendency to think that one solution will solve a given problem. (Start by calling it a problem. There is no pressure to correct ‘issues’)

That is why kids who are learning not to concentrate not on one task at a time but, aided by AIM, e-Mail, streaming video, Skype and cell phones, to “multitask” at very young ages; kids who have less and less rule-free areas in cities and townships to make “innocent” *ahem* mistakes (and no one wants their kids to do the stupid things they have done, but it does them good); and finally kids whose calendars are so filled with schools, sports and ‘extra activities’ that there is no time to be a kid. All this leads to stressed kids having difficulty in school.

The current diagnosis á la mode for this is ADD and shazam – we will treat your kid. Riiight. ADD will go out of style in a few years to be followed by the next wonder drug to treat some illness that is just as fantasist as a Disney cartoon. But one problem, one solution where a systematic and systems approach is necessary.

Fortunately, the social pendulum seems to be reaching the limit of its swing to the right. At least I hope it is. I don’t think it will be allowed to swing back to the left very far though. Just like a real pendulum, things will hang as they are for some time yet.

I am more worried that social and political inequalities are leading the world not to destruction and ruin but to a new kind of feudalism. One where there is a ruling minority elite and everyone else. The elite don’t necessarily keep people out using laws or bloodlines, but the gaps will become all to difficult to overcome. *sigh*

Oh! And by the way. I have absolutely no belief that humans are rational. A few are but most are emotionally driven. It's just that the really intelligent ones come up with better arguments to support the things they already knew to be real.
Tuesday, May 29, 2007 7:01:24 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I always say" it doesn't occur to most people to act with intention". I agree most people are acting on emotion (actually, I think all people act on emotion- reason has no ability to make us act) so...I believe most people are replacing reason with emotion! But I also think people can be more reasonable and can develop new ideas and change old patterns through reason. After all, we do it everyday with regard to mechanical problems. it's just harder to solve relational/social problems where emotion has to figure in prominantly. The problem is that we allow emotion to get in the way when it is inappropriate. For example, there is plenty of evidence that all the tough immigration measures taken since 9/11 have increased the number of immigrants, legal and illegal, from Mexico. For someone who hates spanish speaking peoples populating the Southwest, to argue in favor of walls and stricter laws and enforcement is to argue for laws that contradict his/her purposes. But, the hate gets in the way. Someone who pays close attention to the data may hate immigrants just as much but doesn't allow hate to get in the way of solving the problem. So, we look at a problem like drugs and we have to take accounting the real fear of loved ones doing drugs, of crime and social decay from drug use and use our minds to understand what really works best.

Americans want to be the best, but what is our current idea of what it means to be the best? We are moving to a society that equates the best with the most money. That makes Walmart the best store in America. Lets go back to the drug war. The fact is that the drug war is making money for somebody (municipalities make money through seizures, prison industry is growing fast, leaders are re-elected on promises to get tough, weapons sales to fight drugs in foriegn countries, etc. etc.) thus it is the best solution. There is little profit to be made when people are o.k. ("wanna buy blah blah?" "no I'm o.k!") profit is made when people are not o.k.. I'm not claiming there is some conspiracy here (it doesn't occur to most people to act with intention) rather I believe that profit driven societies find profit driven solutions.

Humans have extremely bad judgment ( I feel no need to dig up studies as the evidence is pervasive and overwhelming, just get on the freeway). But judgment improves when we work together as free individuals. Honest discussion is the beginning and building real human relations is the end. but tah isn't very profitable.
a small penguin
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